THIS SCALA FORUM HAS BEEN ARCHIVED. IT WILL NO LONGER ACCEPT NEW POSTS AFTER APRIL 22, 2009. REPLIES TO EXISTING POSTS WILL BE ACCEPTED THROUGH APRIL 27, 2009. THE NEW FORUM CAN BE FOUND HERE.
Posted: Monday, 4 Aug 2003 5:13 PM -- by John Schilling Notes about AMD CPU's and supporting chipsets:
AMD AthlonXP platforms:
nVidia nForce2-[-S, -ST, -400]
ASUStek A7N8X, A7N8X-Deluxe, A7N8X-VM, A7N8X-X:
http://usa.asus.com/products/mb/socketa/a7n8x/overview.htm
Shuttle XPC SN41G2:
http://us.shuttle.com/specs2.asp?pro_id=284
Observations:
[We have tested a considerable number of SiS7xx and VIA KTxxx Athlon/AthlonXP supporting chipsets. Based on the lack of motherboard stability and poor PCI peripheral card compatibility--SCSI, MPEG-2, RAID-5--we can not recommend these chipsets for Scala IC200/IC3 deployments.]
The nVidia "nForce2" chipsets offers _excellent_ performance and stability. Their principle detraction is that the integrated video performance for the Scala applications is sub-par--however the available internal video modes and refresh rates for PDP and TV-Out
applications is quite good. The Integrated Audio and LAN support is excellent. nForce2 systems when used with a good AGP-8X card provide for excellent overall performance and some of the best available Performance/$$$ available.
AMD-AthlonXP systems are incredibly sensitive to the stability of the Power Supply. It is very important that AthlonXP systems are always deployed in systems with high quality PSU's of the appropriate wattage.
Platforms that support "Dual-Channel" DDR-SDRAM are a significant performance enhancement for Scala IC3 Playback operations. Single Channel DDR-SDRAM differences--e.g. PC2100 vs. PC2700 vs. PC32000 are
of trivial importance. With the types of memory operations that Scala's products perform a Dual-Channel PC2700 motherboard will significantly out-perform a Single-Channel PC3200 motherboard.
High-performance P4 & AthlonXP systems have considerable electrical current requirements and generate a great deal of waste heat. In deployments using these systems it is very important that there be a proper consideration of how the manage the heat these systems
generate.
Make sure that they use the (AMD Thermal guideline OPTIONAL) "Athlon Heat Sink Copper Shim" between the CPU and the heatsink. This optional, typically $3, part is important--given the poor design of the Athlon die/heatsink interface.
Make positive that the vendor follows AMD's Thermal Grease Guidelines--e.g. NOT to use Thermal Paste!!! Only the AMD-approved "PhaseChange" thermal pads are on their AVL. [and esp. never, EVER, use "Silver Particulate" Thermal Grease!]
Athlon CPU/HeatSinks do not travel well via UPS. When shipping such units I would strongly encourage the use of a "Foam Retention Block" be inserted inside the case to fix the heat sink in place during transit--along with a sticker over the power plug socket indicating to
open the case and remove the block prior to attempting to boot the PC!!!
Regards,
--John Schilling, Scala, Inc.
|
Posted: Monday, 21 Jul 2003 12:44 AM -- by Encia>there will be quite a few "caviats" to any AMD system-->they are still not as stable/compatible as most Intel >Chipset systems!
What do you think of nVidia’s nForce 2 series chipsets in terms of stability/compatibility compared with the usual VIA offerings?
HP/Compaq seems to be satisfied with their stability/compatibility for their Athlon based business PCs lines...
Regards
Encia.
|
Posted: Friday, 11 Jul 2003 9:45 PM -- by Nate DownesAs an employee of Genesi SARL, the company that manufactures both the Pegasos and MorphOS, I have to give my own personal experience with Scala here.
Some time ago, I assisted a local community cable station, which ran (ta da da!) 2 A4000's with Scala. I loved those boxes. Frankly, I, personally, would love to see Scala on MorphOS. Heck, we'll be at a convention in a few weeks, and we were just discussing how much we wish we had Scala, the tricks we used to do with Scala, how great it would be to run a Scala presentation on a nice big-screen monitor to woo people into our booth.
Since the Pegasos uses PCI/AGP, same as a PC, the logical idea of course would be to use the PC cards w/ the necessary software.
But man, this brings back memories. (someone pointed me here and asked me what I thought) |
Posted: Friday, 4 Jul 2003 9:44 PM -- by timofonicHi
new stuff such as morphos isnt amiga, but amiga-like, with new, asequible, and good technology such as PPC, PCI, AGP...
PowerPC processors are better, they need less mhz for more power than x86... better performance on things such as 2d and 3D graphics...
The Pegasos Board is a G3 board, isnt big, is a little mobo, doesnt make noise and doesnt produce heat ( inapreciate ) and Pegasos II will be G4 and rumours of PPC970...
The os is MorphOS, have over 7 years of development, is on beta stage but has a lot of things maked, and a lot of things that will be soon recently... This OS is very stable, a nice gui, new hardware support, amiga compatible, efficient... more info on official websites ( www.pegasosppc.com and more... )
A program is maked, Hollywood, a equivalent to the scala for amiga but much better ( http://www.airsoftsoftwair.com/ )
Then why not make a new version for these new PPC machines ? ;)
A lot of companies and independient developers are developing for this machines...
regards from spain
timofonic |
Posted: Wednesday, 19 Feb 2003 11:42 AM -- by John SchillingThe mapping of 720x480/576 to 800x600 or whatever without obvious loss of visual quality is called "Filtering". Most graphics chips available today that support "Hardware Overlay" have some form of such filtering available. Different chips have more or less complex filtering abilities--which results in better or worse visual appearance of such scaled video on differing graphics cards. The nVidia Geforce# and ATI RADEON#### product lines have very good bi-linear filters. [there are some parts that are starting to support bi-cubic filtering which would better yet--but today's chips are not yet really up to the job of doing this in real time]
In my opinion, with the current WHQL drivers, the range of "bad to good" HW-Overlay Filtering is:
SiS6/7xx, S3 "ProSavage"(VIA PLE133/CLE266), Intel 81x/83x/84x, Matrox G5xx, ATI RADEON-####, nVidia GeForce#.
NOTE: In ICD R5 we will be introducing a "Software" Bi-linear filtering algorithm for use in cases where HW-Overlay is not appropriate/desirable/possible. This will come at _GREAT_ CPU% use cost--but Intel and AMD have been solving that part of the problem quite nicely!
And before you ask--yes I am considering approving some AMD Platforms for our AVL--but there will be quite a few "caviats" to any AMD system--they are still not as stable/compatible as most Intel Chipset systems!
--JSS
|
Posted: Friday, 14 Feb 2003 3:06 PM -- by Momir Zecevic Somehow you know how to hit right in my "laughing center". People here at office are looking me as am insane; at least I laugh as I am...
Best regards,
Momir Zecevic
|
Posted: Friday, 14 Feb 2003 12:46 PM -- by Clyde D'souzaRight then John, Point Taken!
I guess I have to agree with you seeing how you have expalined it humor and all :)
( no seriously im not nbeing sarcastic).... shame tho.. she was a nice girlfriend :D
(damn amiga even means girlfriend in spanish)
...One technical question john...about 720x576 video, Im still wondering, for example in software like Windvd and Msmedia player..it playes mpeg clips at full screen smoothly and afaik even "switches" the monitor to 720x576 is this true? or is the video being scaled with some sophisticated algorithm to 800x600?
reason being is, that other VJ (visual) software that I use plays a 720x576 clip full screen but theres definate jagginess on the edges.
Thanks and Respect
Clyde
|
Posted: Friday, 14 Feb 2003 7:34 AM -- by John SchillingClyde, Paar--please remember:
When you are speaking of the Amiga with me, and many others at Scala, you are speaking to the individuals to GAVE YOU THE AMIGA IN THE FIRST PLACE!
There is very little you can tell us about the Amiga--we designed and built it. [and specifically as for the video output circuits--I spent many months of my life testing/debugging Genlock/RAMDAC/NTSC/PAL issues on the Amiga--I used to know its video capabilities rather well...]
(1) PC's today can do "Broadcast Quality" [720x480, 720x576, 1440x960, 1440x1152, 480x480, 360x240, 1280x720, 1360x768, 1920x1080i--whatever] NTSC/PAL/SECAM/DTV as well, if not better, than the Amiga's video circuitry ever could. [...and the Amiga never had a build-in Genlock--the Genlock was an added component--and while some Scala VAR's may had *sold* IC500 integrated in a Amiga with a Genlock and the appropriate EX, the components were all separately charged line items on the bill--any compentent Scala VAR today could make you the same class of product offerings]
We are not bitter--is more like hearing aquaintances talking on, (and on, and on), about an old girlfriend of yours from ten years ago, _every_ time you meet. And she gets prettier with every retelling of the stories. Enough already! Yes, she was cute, Yes the sex was great...really, really, really great; Yes she dressed extremely well--but--her *relatives*, (god her relatives), were another story.... {*not* in my family!} Today's woman _may_ not be as pretty--but she is quite nice in her own way--and she can cook!
The Amiga is over. What is currently calling it self and Amiga is nothing but a releatively standard PowerPC Reference Platform and some software written by some old fans of the Amiga and being marketed by five former Amiga Dealers/Commodore Sales-Marketing guys. There is nothing there that would justify the name--excepting that they are the holders of the trademarks.
As for money--since at various times I've done business with everybody still in the Amiga business--I am rather well aware of the economics. A good shoe store has a higher annual turnover than the entire Amiga industry today.
Enough!
--JSS
|
Posted: Friday, 14 Feb 2003 5:17 AM -- by Axel DenkerIn Latin they say:
De mortuis nil nisi bene.
Say nothing but good about the dead.
We support VCRs and Switchers in our PC products:
http://www.scala.com/ic3-vcr-switcher-leightronix-ex-faq/
Best Regards,
Axel Denker
Scala Netherlands |
Posted: Thursday, 13 Feb 2003 2:11 PM -- by Clyde D'souzaBottom line still remains.. whatever was debeloped for the amiga was one of scala's best efforts... i see a sense of bitterness towards the amiga platform in some of Scala's comments here? why? .. i mean dont mistake me for an amiga evangelist... i too moved on sometime agoo to the pc ( yes same reason... mortgages, food etc) ... but truth be told... Scala is still struggling to get a lot right on the PC platforrm... simple things such as a video switch for a software that is a DIGITAL SIGEAGE product is not there as part of the package, the amiga version had a built in genlock offering that worked fabously! (i still cant figure the Video transparent button in the PC version) full screeen PAL playback is missing in the PC version... you have to scale to nearest 800x600 resolution i think,.... admittedly i may be wrong on some points above,
But as all former Amiga users, it helps to support the remaining few for the sake of nothing else but a nostalgic memory when computing was more than wanting to pay a bigger mortgage, and food wasnt everything ;)
|
Posted: Wednesday, 12 Feb 2003 9:08 AM -- by Pär BobergWell, I hardly think I have that kind of cash, but maybe some Amiga company can, have you talked to any Amiga company if they are interessed in buying the sources??
In what range are you moving - 1k $, 10k $, 100k $, 1m $ or 10m $ ??
Kind regards Pär Boberg
|
Posted: Monday, 10 Feb 2003 9:21 AM -- by John SchillingWell--not likely. In fact about 17 months ago I spent a great deal of effort recovering the archives from all of our DC6250 tapes and restoring them onto a new form of media so that they will be legible in the future.
[actually--it was kind of funny--all of Scala: Oslo's Development Servers/Amiga Workstations, etc. came to 1.7 GB of data...]
As for selling the Source Code--make us an offer!
We are a business...
:-)
--John
|
Posted: Monday, 10 Feb 2003 5:49 AM -- by Pär BobergDead?? Naa, I don't think so...but maybe in your eyes...
I hardly think that you can call Amiga dead, when there is still a lot of people around making new software and hardware.
Just look at the AmigaOS 4 and AmigaOne and all the websites dedicated to Amiga computers. A computer platform
ain't dead until nothing/nobody is left and you can hardly say that about Amiga. Why do you think people still use Amiga, because it's a great computer, I really don't think anyone whould still use it, if it were a shit computer...
Also one of the reasons why we use Amiga, is that we love the computer and the OS and because we don't want to be like a pack of sheeps, going where everybody else is going.
The people that left a long time ago, were probably just around for the games or the money that could be made.
The people that are still around, are the true Amigans, that are willing to spend their last buck, just to support the platform, since they don't like Windows that bloody much!
Well, then sell the sources...
And if you don't want to do that either, isn't it just as good to just erase the Amiga sources, so people can't bother you with it again?? |
Posted: Tuesday, 4 Feb 2003 5:11 PM -- by John SchillingO.K., Let's go with the basics:
The core of the Software Development team at Scala, past and present, WROTE the Amiga OS at Commodore.
Scala's V.P. of Corporate Sales DESIGNED the Amiga 500. [the A3000 Designer was also an Engineer at Scala--but he has left for other HW-releated design tasks]
Scala's CEO was once the V.P. of Engineering at Commodore.
I was a manufacturing engineer at Commodore--I have personally had phyical contact with every single A4000T Commodore ever built! [and worked as a Consultant to Escom for their A1200/A4000T production run...]
We know the Amiga. And to paraphrase the good doctor of the Starship Enterprise: "She's dead, Paar". Get over it.
The Scala Amiga Product Source code is the property of Scala, Inc. Most of us are shareholders in Scala, Inc. Why would we want to give away our property? Esp. since the only use of that property would be to elliminate sales of the products that we are currently selling. The products that pay our mortages, feed our children, and pay for everything that makes our lives possible?
Paar--we make a very good PC-based product that meets your needs. It can do things that the Amiga product would never have been capabile of. You might find it to your advantage to purchase it.
Regards,
--John Schilling, Scala, Inc.
|
Posted: Tuesday, 4 Feb 2003 11:48 AM -- by Pär BobergNo, that's not good enough, I want it on two different computers, one "creator" and one "player" and then send the script through a serial cable or some other device.
Which I'm doing right now.
Currently IC500 is the only one that can do that on the Amiga and I also need the schedule function, since we run name day and other stuff.
And I really want to support the small Amiga community by buying two AmigaOnes with OS4 and currently SCALA is the only thing that stands in the way...
I don't want to buy PC's just because SCALA sits on the sources and because everybody else buys PC's.
The Amiga and it's OS may not have all that fancy stuff everybody else has, but that doesn't concern me, as long as it does what it's supposed to do and that's just what it does right now, except for the OS 4 and RTG problem... |
Posted: Tuesday, 4 Feb 2003 10:15 AM -- by Paul MillerHave you considered installing Amiga Forever and MM400 on a fast PC? It works. Both are availabe from SoftwareHut. The MM400 is dongle free. Don't know about IC500 dongle-free, but maybe Scala will help with a solution.
Paul Miller |
